Camellia (LSE:CAM) — FY25 Results

0:00 Good morning, and welcome to CAMELLIA PLC Full Year twenty twenty five Results Presentation. The Company may not be in a position to answer every question received during the meeting itself. However, company can review all questions submitted today and publish responses where appropriate to do so. Before we begin, we'd like to submit the following poll. I'd now like to hand you over to Byron Coombs, CA. Good morning, sir. Good morning. Good morning, everyone, and, welcome to CAMELLIA's 2025, results presentation. I'm Byron Coombs, CAMMELLIA's CEO, and on my right is Oliver Capon as chief financial officer. On my left is Graham McLean, director of agriculture.

0:49 We're gonna now run a twenty minute prerecorded presentation, following which we'll turn the cameras back on and, go into a q and a session. So, perhaps, Paul, if you could start us off. Thank you. Good morning, and welcome to the, review of CAMELLIA's 2025 financial results. This is the usual disclaimer. In particular, please note that no representations are being made by this presentation. I'm Byron Coombs, CEO of CAMELLIA. Alongside me is Oliver Capon, chief financial officer, and Graham McClain, director of agriculture. I'll begin this presentation by saying a few words about CAMELLIA and the value enhancement plan that we announced this time last year.

1:38 Oliver will then take us through the 2025 financials, and Graham will take us through the 2025 operational results. I will then conclude the presentation with a short summary of our priorities for 2026. CAMELLIA was established in 1889 and has undergone many transformations over the past a hundred and thirty six years. CAMELLIA is best seen as a holding company with stewards 10 operating businesses and manages a portfolio of other assets. In 2025, following considerable internal evaluation and analysis, CAMELLIA outlined its medium term goals through the value enhancement plan with a priority of delivering long term value for all its stakeholders.

2:29 The VEP sees the company sharpening its operational focus on large scale agriculture and closely connected downstream activities. Informing and guiding the VEP are CAMELLIA's purpose and values. CAMELLIA was founded on the basis of delivering attractive shareholder returns alongside supporting the welfare of its employees and their communities and a commitment to sustainable environmental practices. In 2025, CAMELLIA generated revenues of 268,000,000. These revenues derived from eight large scale agricultural businesses, two UK companies, and certain nonoperating assets.

3:18 The eight agricultural companies are spread across India, Bangladesh, Kenya, Tanzania, Malawi, South Africa, and Brazil. CAMELLIA is a major producer of tea, avocados, and macadamia nuts, but also produces arable, rubber, and forestry products. In addition, we have recently been conducting a trial in blueberry production. The two UK companies are AJT, a Scottish engineering business, and Jing, a London based luxury tea packet company. In addition to the operating businesses, CAMELLIA has historically owned a range of nonoperating assets, which we are currently in the process of selling. This time last year, we announced our new medium term business plan.

4:11 The VEP outlines our strategy to focus the company's activity on agriculture and agricultural product processing. The VEP aims to deliver improved operating results, reduced business risk, and long term revenue growth at a faster pace. Oliver and Graham will take you through the progress we made in 2025. But before I hand over to them, let me first highlight a few of the business levers we will be pulling over the next few years. We believe that there is significant financial upside for the company if we accomplish some of the following actions. Sell our nonoperating assets and redeploy the capital and income generating projects, sell loss making and non core business units, employ new technology and better processes to improve core business efficiency, and leverage the existing assets and infrastructure of our operating companies.

5:15 We're also exploring business opportunities to grow our revenues. These opportunities are focused around our core operating companies. Oliver and Graham will highlight these opportunities, the ones we have already identified and are now progressing. With that, let me hand you over to Oliver. Thank you, Byron. Financial performance in 2025 was a significant improvement on 2024. Revenues rose slightly in the year and trading profit, the key metric that shows the underlying state of the business, showed a £1,000,000 profit in the year compared to a £5,500,000 loss in 2024. This shows that the business is moving in the right direction, though still not where we want it to be.

6:05 We realized £20,000,000 of proceeds and £4,700,000 of profits on the sale of real estate, the collections and Indian tea gardens. We also announced the sale of the remaining parts of the Lynton Park Estate last month and the successful sale of somewhat more artwork. We now have only one UK investment properties on the market, and we expect to sell the remaining artwork in 2026 and the rest of the collections by the end of twenty twenty seven. Profits from these sales were offset by losses on exchange on our U. S. Dollar deposits and the impact of high preface re accounting in Malawi. The net investment income driven from our liquid holdings helped the group to a profit before tax of GBP 3,000,000.

6:54 The loss after tax was GBP 4,100,000. The high effective tax rate is partly driven by the location of the profits and the inability to claim deferred tax assets in some of the loss making countries and partly a one off tax charge of GBP 1,900,000 in the P and L for deferred tax, which is offset by an equal amount in other comprehensive income. The cash position remains healthy, with a modest improvement in the cash position on last year. Investments increased slightly from 2024, and we expect this to increase further in 2026 as we progress some of the investment opportunities, which Graham will cover later. We will remain diligent in the allocation of capital and will only pursue investments when the returns are deemed at a sufficient level and are commensurate with the risks.

7:48 The Board is proposing to keep the dividend at the same amount as 2024 at $2.60 pence. This remains funded out of reserves, but underscores the belief the board has in the company's future. The improvement in trading profits is a combination of market conditions coupled with some early successes from the VEP. The largest impacts were from Bangladesh where production was down due to early drought but prices were significantly higher. In addition, the company managed to sell more than its production in a year by selling down its twenty twenty four carryover stock and limiting the year end inventory. In India, where production was down driven by drought at the start of the season.

8:34 EPK was impacted by a fall in production when compared to the exceptional production in 2024 and a weakening of tea prices caused by oversupply in the market. Kikusi recovered in 2025 from a poor 2024 driven by a 27% increase in avocado production as well as a 40% increase in macadamia prices. Malawi benefited from increased macadamia production after the 2024 crop was impacted by cyclone freddy, as well as improvements in price. Revenues from tea were lower due to lower prices. The new trading business helped to boost profits in the year. Brazil continues to shine and had a record 2025 with profits increasing by GBP 1,100,000, driven by higher production across all main crops and improved pricing.

9:29 The other businesses improved year on year, with Jing's revenues up 19% and AJT's profits improving. I'll now hand you over to Greg. Thank you, Oliver. I would now like to bring you up to speed with the progress we have made in relation to our value enhancement plan. Creating shareholder value remains at the forefront of our objectives. Through CAMELLIA's agricultural operations, which are both widespread and varied, we continue to focus on actionable steps to optimize our cost structure, expand high margin products and enhance shareholder value. We remain committed to the strategic operational goals laid out last year in our VEP, which sets out to maximize efficiency and productivity, strengthen margins and accelerate growth.

10:20 In doing so, we also recognize the need to mitigate the group's exposure to the challenges faced in a world of economic unpredictability and variations in climate. We are now in the first full year of the VEP and I am happy to share with you some of the initiatives that are building momentum and to illustrate how we intend to develop these further going forward. Recent technological advancements and the increase in automation in our businesses have driven change, both in terms of streamlining workflows and reducing operating costs. For example, the introduction of electric plucking shears in Malawi, Bangladesh and India has seen gains in harvesting productivity, leading to a reduction in the number of temporary workers across all three businesses.

11:13 The trial use of drone technology has provided effective real time data for monitoring water canopy health. Additionally, the impact of drones on certain security operations has reduced costs and risks to people. Maintaining a reliable sustainable water supply remains critical to our day to day operations. The continued investment in water capture, storage and security is ongoing. In Brazil, the further renovation of vital reservoirs and the expansion of irrigation on arable land have been carried out with an increase of two eighty five hectares under new pivots. In Tanzania, the construction of a new 1,000,000 cubic meter reservoir continues.

12:02 The reduction of our exposure to tea production in Africa and Asia forms a major component of the VUP. During 2025, Manawi repurposed three seventy five hectares of marginal tea land into fuel wood production. In India, two unprofitable tea gardens were sold and a further MOU has been signed. Land in India is being considered for solar development, tourism, dairy and pig production. A large solar installation has been established on Chimomitir State in Nandy Hills, Kenya. We are intent on meaningfully growing our agricultural businesses. Over the next couple of slides, I will outline two existing growth initiatives, which are being materially advanced as well as two new growth projects approved during 2025.

12:58 The group's avocado development in Tanzania continues apace with four fifty hectares of fully irrigated orchards now established. A further 100 hectares will be planted in 2026 and 2027 bringing the total to six fifty hectares. We are also building a fully integrated avocado packhouse in 2026 which will be ready for the harvest season. This will have the capacity for both our fruit and third party producers. This year is expected to be the first significant year of production for the operation at 200,000 cartons or 800 tons, with an anticipated revenue of GBP 1,700,000, which is expected to grow to GBP 17,000,000 by 2034.

13:47 Given today's climate volatility, water security is a critical strategic importance to our operations and is a vital component of the long term sustainability and success of our agricultural businesses. In Tanzania, the construction of a substantial reservoir to be completed before the rains in October will secure 1,000,000 cubic meters of water for the operations Avocado Orchard. In line with our commitment to optimizing the yield of our operations, we are engaging in the conversion of lower return land into high yielding profitable biological assets, thereby increasing the group's value, an integral part of our productivity improvement strategy. In Brazil, this is being achieved through the repurposing of commercial forestry into more profitable arable production.

14:39 A total of eight fifteen hectares is to be converted, of which two thirds is complete, with 30% of the new arable area under irrigation. This converted area now contributes about 15% of the operations total soy production. The remaining land will be converted by 2027. Through repurposing this land, we will benefit from recurrent revenue from an area that historically only benefited from income once every decade. Crop and revenue diversification, growing profit growing profitably and reducing risk are front and center of the DEP's objectives.

15:27 Reducing our reliance on soya, currently about 55% of CC Laurie's revenue, will lower our exposure to the fluctuations in global grain markets. We will embark on a major citrus development of over 400 hectares in Brazil. The planting will commence in August this year. This diversification forms part of our aim to enhance revenue and reduce risk while utilizing existing land, infrastructural assets and management. The land currently earmarked for much of this project will be reclaimed from commercial forestry, as just described, making it ideal for water development and improving returns on the land. The focus of the citrus initiative will be on the production of fruit for sale to orange juice processes.

16:16 Some 30% of the fruit will be channeled into the local retail sector, capturing additional value without the logistical challenges or costs associated with post harvest infrastructure. The proximity of our operation to advanced processing units and Brazil's strategic importance in the global supply of orange juice make it a strategically efficient and profitable venture. Planting will reach its target of 400 hectares in 2029, with about 100 hectares being planted each year. The first yield is expected in 2028. Production is anticipated throughout the year with the planting of early, mid and late season varieties, thereby creating a recurring revenue stream and reducing the peak temporary labor requirements.

17:07 Supply contracts to local processes guarantee a market for the harvest, which will help to stabilize income by ensuring a set volume is purchased at a known price, reducing dependence on volatile supply chains. This development significantly expands the operations irrigated area, transforming climate variability from a structural risk into a competitive advantage and helping to stabilize cash flow, generating revenues of over £7,000,000 by 2034. It has been a long term strategic goal for the Kikuzi operation in Kenya to further diversify its cropping base and reach the market. With world market demand for blueberries growing at a CAGR of over 5% driven by consumer awareness of the fruit's superior health benefits, a commercial blueberry trial was implemented six years ago to assess the viability of this crop in Kenya.

18:07 The trial has now reached a positive conclusion and the operation will be expanded. The initial plan is to establish a further 12 hectares in 2026, more than doubling the production area to 22 hectares. The aspiration thereafter is to reach a critical operational scale of 80 which will see volumes grow tenfold over the next seven years to 1,700 tonnes with a revenue rising to over £11,000,000 a year. The strategic initiatives described are the largest, most significant projects being undertaken amongst a wide range of others. They are core to the VEP objectives as they deliver improved operational efficiencies and performance, reduce risk through diversification and enhance border security.

19:00 In summary, and as illustrated on the slide, in consolidating a future view of the growth in revenue generated between 2026 and 2034, an impressive picture unfolds. Generation of revenue over a period of eight years shows the maturing avocado development in Tanzania, the establishment of a new citrus operation in Brazil and the expansion of the blueberry operation at Kikuzi, all lead to significant growth in revenues, about GBP 35,000,000 per year for CAMELLIA and its shareholders. I will now hand over to Byron, who will provide his summary and concluding remarks.

19:47 Thank you, Graham. I mentioned earlier in this presentation that there are a range of business levers that we can pull to achieve our medium term plan and deliver the financial results that investors are looking for. The four examples that Graham talked about are well aligned with our strategy, and I think good examples of what is to come. The projects will improve our ROA. They will generate higher revenues from existing land, infrastructure, and management teams, and they are relatively low risk and low cost initiatives. Let me conclude with a few forward looking comments. Firstly, with respect to our 2026 outlook, you will know that we're not able to provide meaningful guidance at this time of the year.

20:32 We intend to provide an update at the interim announcement in early September. Secondly, in 2026, we are focusing on operational efficiency to drive higher trading profits, a crucial component of the VEP. I would note, however, that the recent Iran conflict has resulted in both cost increases and operational challenges. Events such as these, make the goal of improving operational efficiency both more difficult and also more important. Thirdly, we are continuing to examine ways of reducing the portfolio's overall risk with a longer term goal of reducing the downside volatility of both revenues and profits.

21:19 And finally, we're exploring growth opportunities with a current expectation that we'll identify one or more attractive projects this year. Our current focus is on internal opportunities and acquisitions that are natural extensions of the core businesses that we have today. Thank you for listening to the CAMELLIA twenty twenty five update. Fantastic. Thank you very much indeed for your presentation. Ladies and gentlemen, do please continue to submit your questions. But just while the team take a few moments to review those questions submitted today, I'd like to remind you the recording of the presentation along with a copy of the Q and A will be available on your investor dashboard.

22:06 Let me just bring your cameras up, team. There we go. Fantastic. Look. We've had a number of questions, and thank you to all the investors who have submitted those today. Perhaps if I may, let's just start with the first one. Is the VEP going to plan? Session. And so VEP. Well, we announced the VEP just about this time last year. So we got best part of six or seven months in in 2025 to begin working on that. I think it's it's going very well. It's still early days, but it is going very well. We've managed to focus in the early months on continuing to dispose of our nonoperating assets. So that would be the property, the art collection, the stamp collection, the investment portfolio, and so on.

23:02 Good progress was made last year on the property side. And towards the end of last year, we put in place some plans for the sale of the art this year, some of which has been taken forward, but more is to be done as we go through the year. The stamps, we have a plan now for disposing of the stamps. A good part of them will be done this year. A good part will then be taken forward into twenty twenty twenty seven. We exited our investment portfolio towards the end of the year taking advantage of what at the time was was good prices in the market. So I think, the first task really of of continuing to dispose of non nonoperating assets is well underway, and we should get that done, I would say, by well, substantially by the end of this year with a tail into 2027 on the stats.

23:53 We also made some good progress, I think, on the growth side of the business. And so, you know, towards the end of last year, we approved two projects that are growth initiatives. Graham talked a little bit about that earlier in the presentation. So we've got two good two good growth initiatives that we've we've we've approved in at the end of last year. And there are other growth initiatives which we continue to work on that we're already in train and we are we're building upon. So I think there's some growth coming through. Clearly, there's more to be done on that in 2026, and I would say that we have, we receive a great many opportunities for investments, and we get quite a lot of demand from our underlying operating companies for investments.

24:44 We're quite careful about that, but I would hope that by the end of the year, have more to say about how we're gonna grow the business in the years ahead. We also made a bit of progress on operational efficiency. And, again, there's some evidence of that in the 2025 financial results. It's a big focus of ours this year. We spent a lot of time talking about it at the end of last year and and into q one of this year. And I think that absent the problems from the Iran war, which is now going to weaken some of that, there's some good progress being made to to improve the operational returns of the underlying core businesses. Finally, in terms of looking at some of the loss making businesses and and the structure of the portfolio and and managing some of the risk, we managed to sell two tea gardens last year.

25:39 That's reduced our exposure to tea, and it's also reduced our exposure to assets that we didn't feel we could make profits out of. So I think we've made good progress. We're very conscious that, you know, it's still very early, and and investors are gonna need to see a lot more this year. So, you know, we're working on that. Thank you. Fantastic. Thank you very much indeed. I think you've actually covered, well, some of this question, if not all of this question. What are the plans for the rest of the collection as investment properties? Just if there is anything to add. Yeah. I think so. I I can answer that one. So we currently have two investment properties left in The UK. One will be sold this year, hopefully, and the second one is not currently on the market. It's being used partly by Jane and partly by others. It's still classified as an investment property for us. So by the end of this year, we hope to just have that one property classified as an investment property in The UK.

26:35 Super. Thank you. Another question here. Can you elaborate on the impacts on the business of the current conflicts in The Middle East and the closure of the Strait Of Hermes? Sure. Thanks, Paul. I'll I'll take that that query. We have actually had impact in four areas across our operating companies as a result of the conflict areas mentioned. So the cost and supply of fuel, pretty much across the board, we've seen price increases in fuel. And in certain places, we've seen some shortages coming in. The other big impact has been on the cost and supply of fertilizers. Again, price increases pretty much across the board, particularly in the nitrogen phosphate fertilizers, but also some possible future supply hurdles that we're gonna have to overcome later in the year. Also seen a lot of impact on our shipping logistics in particular with shipping planning being disrupted through delays and and and rerouting of vessels, particularly as there's many vessels tied up in the in the Straits Of 4 Moors at the moment.

27:43 And we've also had a bit of impact in terms of our markets, particularly those in The Middle East and in Iran. We sell or the nation of Kenya sells tea into Iran as as India. And, obviously, those those contracts or supply arrangements have been have been impacted somewhat. And we've also had an impact on sales volumes from G, our our major tea brand that we sell into The UAE as a as a particular focus market. So the longer the the conflict goes on, the larger we anticipate the impact to be, and we're finding that this all these events rather are particularly disappointing for our management teams of our operating companies. They have spent a great deal of time and put in a huge amount of work in terms of developing plans to structurally improve the operational efficiencies of their businesses and make these operational changes count for the long term.

28:44 However, it's clear that these benefits will be impacted and partially offset by the issues that are are ongoing and in distressful moves and and also in Iran. So we're working with the opcos to identify opportunities to mitigate these impacts. And as such, the the various different businesses are impacted differently, and are approaching these mitigation measures, in different ways, but they are all reacting very, very proactively and positively, to the challenges that they are facing. Thank you. Thank you very much indeed. Were you happy with the sale price of Linton Park, particularly as it's on the market for 30,000,000? I think it's two parts. One is the emotional and one is the financial.

29:34 I think emotionally, we're we're very sad to say goodbye to the park. It's been part of the CAMELLIA family for a long time, and it's held very dear to a lot of people within CAMELLIA. Financially, I was very happy to say goodbye to the park. It's an expensive asset to maintain, and it costs about £400,000 a year to maintain. I would have had to spend significant amounts from capital in the near term to keep it in the state it needs to be. So from a financial standpoint, it's a good thing to do. The price was the best price we thought we could get. It's on the market for 30,000,000. We think that is an unrealistic price at the time, and we had no interest at that price. So, clearly, the market didn't believe it was worth 30,000,000.

30:20 We made the decision in 2024 to split up the estate and sell the parts independently. We think that has been successful, and we're comfortable that we've the best price we possibly could for that asset in the current market conditions. Thank you. Next question here. What are you going to do with the cash pile? You've kept the dividend constant. Are you considering a special dividend with all the money that you have? So where to start with so I I think, you know, first of all, let's go back a little bit. The the board spent all of 2024 looking at the underlying components of the company, thinking about the company's value, its strategy, and where where it could make make make a return out of the businesses that it already has.

31:11 It then backed the VEP, and that VEP we are confident within that VEP that we can deliver a successful and attractively profitable business. Part of that process, though, was to have capital back to investors. So under the under the tender offer, we we repaid investors some capital. And at the same time, we also repaid investors through the 260p of of annual dividend. We're proposing that dividend again this year and subject to the approval of the AGM, we expect that to go through. Indeed, you know, we'll probably continue to pay that dividend for a time to come, although, you know, those are obviously discussions that will be held down the road, but that that's our intent.

32:04 So we've been returning shareholder returning capital to shareholders. That's that's the first thing. The second thing is what to do with the remaining capital. And, you know, part of this is being an active manager of our portfolio, and so we are freeing up a lot of assets. We'll be deploying those assets in higher income investments, and we'll be actively managing the underlying investments themselves, core investments to extract better value from them. So from that, we believe within a year or two, we are able to generate you know, create a company with a healthy set of sustainable profits. There is no, consideration being given to a special dividend at this point. Thank you.

32:50 Next question we've got here. The Marook Farm situated in the state of Sao Paulo is a region of well known and actively present citrus diseases. How can you be sure your plantations will be safe? Thank you, Paul. First of all, let me just say this, as I mentioned in the in the overview of the VP, this is a very exciting diversification and development for our Mariki farm in in Brazil. In terms of the the citrus development, yes, screening and other citrus diseases is of major concern and is a massive area of focus in the development. So first and foremost, we must ensure that we source and procure disease free resistant varieties from accredited and screened nurseries. That is absolutely sacrosanct to make sure that the that the original or initial planting material that we establish is is very much disease free and has come from a reputable resource. So that is that is absolutely front and center of of starting the the project.

33:55 Once everything's established or once the plants are established, rigorous disease vector control, so the silid so vector needs to be controlled, and we intend to do this through constant orchard monitoring. In other words, scouting daily for for any silid activity and also the use of integrated pest management through the use of chemical and biological controls, which we intend to apply through practice spraying, and also through our irrigation, regimes that we'll establish. Disease tree eradication is an absolute, essential, management, tool as well. It has to be strict, uncompromising, and immediate in terms of removal of any affected trees and their their their replanting thereafter.

34:46 We also look to engage very high caliber and experienced advisers and consultants for this project to ensure that we're following the correct procedures and and protocols, and we also intend to employ a very experienced and excellent citrus manager to manage the project from its inception. Thank you. You. One from Christophe here. Did you ever look at palm oil? It's a very it's a very profitable area. I I no. We have not really looked at palm oil, to be honest with you, and I think it's not on our agenda. We have certain crops that we know very well and certain markets that we know very well, and we don't intend to stray very far from from what we what we do well.

35:34 I would just add that we do have a a small trial of palm oil in in India, which has been under undergoing for a number of years. So we're continuing to analyze the results coming from that to see if there's any anything further we can do in terms of development in that part of the world. You. Question from John. Why is Jing still not profitable even after a 19% increase in revenues? What initiatives are there in place to correct this? And should this asset be considered for sale where potential purchasers could achieve scale economies of scale? Apologies. Not sure if I understand the synergy between this business and the broader agricultural assets. So I think this question you know, why don't we broaden this question out a little bit and and just talk about the portfolio in general?

36:21 You know, that it's a good question regarding Jing. You know, I know that there are probably one or two questions on AJT and some of the other assets as well. We're a business that you know, we're a holding company. We manage our underlying portfolio of assets actively, and I think it's fair to say that when we think about selling a business, we're thinking about two things. Have we have we developed that business to a point where we feel we've we've got the most out of it and it's positioned well and and presented well in the market? And at the same time, you know, is the market is the market demand attractive at that point in time? And I think we're sort of figuring out both of those when it comes to, you know, quite a few of our assets. But, you know, that that that that's, I think, the broadest context I can provide on on Jing, AJT, and indeed other other assets that we have.

37:16 Thank you. Can you elaborate on the land claim in Kikuzy? What parts of land does it impact, and what activities occur in these areas? Is it crop production, etcetera? What is the potential cost of moving this production and infrastructure to different locations? Well, thanks. I'll I'll take that one. Firstly, these these there are multiple land claims that are historic land injustice claims that have been submitted through the the National Lands Commission in Kenya, and they have all been heard through that process that the National Lands Commission conducted through 2024 and then issued their recommendations in 2025. And these recommendations have basically been contested by CAMPUSY in court, and these court these cases are all ongoing, and we are in the process of following all of the the advice that we're receiving from our legal counsel on these matters.

38:21 So therefore, as of now and currently, there is no impact to our operations in any way, shape, or form, and we are continuing as normal whilst these these cases are being pursued through the various courts. Many thanks. You mentioned in the annual report the company is seeking investment opportunities for its capital that provide the required bridge for the short and medium term. Can you give more information on this? Is this a reference to bond buying or companies? So I'll I'll take this one. So the bridge we're talking about is the next few years where we're get to a position where we're both able to go and pay the dividend out of cash from the dividend coming up from our operating companies as well as being able to cover it from our from our normal profit. So if we invest too much in in assets, which we're gonna deliver cash and and revenue in in eight to ten years time, then we're not gonna be in that situation. So we're looking to make investments in either put other assets close to our farms or potentially companies close to our farms, which deliver short term cash. So that's kind of the key elements of our investment, short term investment requirements to get short term cash delivery to bridge that gap between where we are now where we're not covering the dividend to a position where we are covering our dividend.

39:42 Thank you. Next question we've got here is why have we not seen even a modest buyback of our shares? Well, I I think, you know, we tried a a buyback program. The the liquidity wasn't really there, and the system didn't really work very well for us on AIM. So we tried that. It didn't really work. We did do a tender offer, and we placed it, I think, at at the right price, and we placed the right amount, and and we got we got a buyback of something else 60 odd percent or so. So I think we've done that for the time being. We're focusing really now on on how do we improve the actual underlying businesses themselves, and there's a great deal more opportunity in this company than we have yet extracted, and that's our focus at the moment.

40:32 Thank you. Christopher John here. How can the board explain current valuation? When you take the last net cash, the recent sale proceeds, it's greater than the market cap. Does this imply the market has concerns on success of capital redeployment, m and a? Should the company not consider distributing at least a portion of surplus cash? I'll take that one. So the market valuation is what the market valuation is. There's I think we can concentrate on the business and making sure the business gets to a position where we want it to get to, and, that'll have an impact on the market price. So the the key element for us I mean, to me, the the key on why the the stock is is undervalued is the fact we're not covering our dividends. And I think that said to me that the key element for us to be able to cover our dividends both from a cash coverage of the dividend as well as a profitable covering of the dividend. I think if we get that position, we'll see the the mark the market price following that. So that's that's my the AIM market is a difficult market at the moment as most people know.

41:36 I think we there's some devaluation based on AIM as well. But to me, we don't concentrate on the day to day market price because we're making sure the the business gets to where we want it to get to. Thank you very much indeed. What place does AJT have in the group long term? Is this being considered for sale? I think to some extent that goes back to the question I answered a little bit earlier on. And, you know, with with all of the assets but AJT, Jing, and and one or two others, you know, we keep them under review, and we're working very hard. AJT was not a profitable business until really last eighteen months or so, and, we've worked very hard to make it profitable. It's profitable now. It's got one or two initiatives inside it that we quite like the look of. So we're we're looking at that.

42:24 We're monitoring that, and, and and and we'll see where we get to. Fantastic. Thank you very much indeed. The recently sold artwork were held on the books at extremely low value, circa £100,000 versus proceeds of 3,500,000. Is there something particular about these assets that gave rise to the differential between book and sale value? And could the remaining heritage assets achieve an extreme premium to book to? So the artwork's been bought over a long period of time. It's been held at a historic cost. So that's the reason why the low low value in the books compared to to market price. And we we held some very nice pieces of it of Indian art, and the market for that is is quite hot at the moment. Do I expect a similar uplift for the next set? I think I would hope, but I think realistically, we shouldn't be expecting that sort of uplift in the future.

43:17 These were some very exceptional pieces of art which were sold. Hopefully, we'll get similar we hope we get an uplift in terms of against mark against book value. I don't think we're gonna get the same extreme uplifts that we saw in the first in the first sales. It's probably worth saying that the stamps have have also some potential upside, but not of the same sort of magnitude. So, you know, the different assets are are seeing different demand in the market at the moment, which is why we're timing them in the way we are. Thank you. You mentioned the low take up of tender as being indicative. The remaining investors are very supportive of the strategy. Could it also be that the tender price was too low and a new tender at more sensible value considered? The level of cash liquid assets versus the need is anonymous.

44:08 I'll take that one. Well, we we priced the tender offer based on two things. So we have two two distinct groups of shareholders. We had some shareholders who wanted to get out, and and there's some shareholders who didn't want to participate in the tender offer. And so we had to go and balance the pricing based on those two groups of shareholders and get a price which enabled us to get the tender offer voted through, but also but to make sure that both sides were were were happy with the with the number. So we priced it where we we had been priced it because of that. There's no no plans for another tender offer, and we'll talk a bit about this in the next question when we talk about where we're gonna how much we're gonna spend going forward. But at the end of day, we need to go and make sure we have a sustainable business in the long run. And tender offer basically takes cash out of the business without any prospect of delivering returns in the future. So it's something we're not gonna do at the moment.

44:59 Thank you. The capital expenditure of between 15 and 25,000,000 mentioned in the strategic report, is the is this additional to 8,000,000 to 10,000,000 of maintenance CapEx? Is it on existing sites or new acquisition? If the latter, what's being considered? Yes. It's it's an addition to the 8 to 10. So we're looking at 23 to 35,000,000 of of CapEx going forward. We're looking at both investing in existing existing farms. So the examples in Maruky and Kikuzy. And we're also looking at approximate investments to investments close to what we're currently doing, which will enable us to hopefully defray our management costs over wider areas and also invest in areas that we know and understand well.

45:48 Thank you. Can you elaborate on the sale process of Easton Produce Cape? It's been going on for some time with no outcome. I'll I'll take that. Yes. It is still it is still on the market. It's very true that it's been on the market for for some time without there being any successful bid made for for the operation. We do continue with a grape wine grape production operation on the farm, and we do maintain all the assets that exist on the farm as in in the in top quality condition. So the the farm is still very much operational. It is being kept to a very high standard and effectively, is a very sort of low level, DOS making operation currently.

46:34 It is still on the market. There are, various sort of, points of interest, but nothing actually translates into an actual sale of the operation. Super. Thank you. With the sale of Linton artworks and the listed securities post period end, is the cash greater than a 160,000,000? No. It's not. The reason behind that is that, yes, you had some proceeds in from from Linton and some of the proceeds from the artwork has come in. But, also, this appeared in the year where our net cash balance has always fall because we're harvest haven't reached the peak harvest time in fatigue, particularly in India or Bangladesh, and the macadamia crop as we've paid the cost out of the macadamia crops, we haven't received the income yet. So the first half of the year is always a period where our cash cash balances fall, and then we recoup in the in the latter half of the year.

47:25 So so it's not a 160,000,000 at the moment. Super. Thank you. Why is it not being possible to generate a higher finance income from such a large net cash position? How are you optimizing return on this cash? I think, you know, the one or two companies have third party debt, and that that that offsets the offsets the the net interest income or the interest income on the on on the cashes that we do have. And that's something that we're very attuned to and we're working on, and there are ways of going about that which is efficient, and we're trying to execute that. But it will take potentially a number of months yet before we see some success. I I would hope that by the end of the year, we've made some progress on that matter.

48:12 I mean, we invested the cash conservatively on purpose. We don't want to invest in the stock market or or or other assets which have high volatility to make sure we actually have that cash is available for investment when we need it. Fantastic. Look. Thank you very much indeed for answering those questions you can for investors. And, course, the company can review all questions as as day, and we publish those responses on the investor me company platform. Before redirecting investors to provide you their feedback, know it's particularly important to you. Byron, if I may just ask you for some closing comments, please. Well, not very much for me, but thank thank you all for joining us today. You know, we appreciate your interest in the company, and we have a lot of work this year. So we look forward to coming back to you in September and updating you on on progress that we've made, and thank you very much.

49:06 Fantastic. Thank you for updating investors today. Can I please ask investors not to close this session? It should be automatically redirected to provide your feedback, nor the team can better understand your views and expectations. This will only take a few moments to complete, and I know it's greatly valued by the company. On behalf of the management team of CAMELLIA PLC, we'd like to thank you for attending today's presentation. That concludes today's session, and good morning to you all.